Wrong.

The buff happened to make this weapons and ships compareble to other COMBAT ships.

NOT to make your anti sozial ganker life easier!

CCP just ignored (as usual) the influence on Industrials and Miners (as CCP hate Indutrials and Miners, we all know it).

You said it was the victims fault 100%? Is there some sliver above 100% that I am unaware of? Shall we check your math? 100% seems pretty absolute to me, how about you?





And your equivocation and huburis is exposed. Thanks for playing.

Wrong.

CCP FORCES them to be a victim with gimped slot layouts and fitting stats!

In addition some "you mad bro" loser PvPer chose to pick eazy targets as he was to unskilled to survive real PvP.

So much fail, unbeliveble and terrible troll attemp.

There is just one reason you pick Hulks+Industrials : YOU are to bad for real PvP

Why should I if I don't like it?

And who tells you I wouldn't know how to?

But I must be blind and stupid to not see the gimpnes of Mining and Industrial ships. Even my hamster might have enough brain to see it.

@ Tip
The amount of complaints about its lack of survivability proves something as well. Of course this is easier to ignore right?

You can cease with the personl pronouns about how and what I fit, the hulk I do have is rather old, and until very recently wasn't worth undocking at all, and frankly still isn't.

And there are better ways to make a ship gank proof than fitting a tank, but I'll let you ponder that one, see if it'll drag you out of your black and white box of safe arguments.

Then tell me why
[Rokh, New Setup 2]
4*Mining Laser Upgrade II
Co-Processor II

8*Miner II

3*Large Cargohold Optimization I

Mining Drone II x5
Hobgoblin II x5

is such a great mining ship. (1371 yield/min without gank bonis and implants)

what the **** are you doing putting a mwd on a hulk

CFC forum troll 1

CFC forum troll 2

Your posts in here are : we want Hulkgeddon

I don't expect any real discussions with you 2.

If you are unable to scroll up and find the reason.

But for god will remove the MWD and use a LSB
[Hulk, New Setup 2]
Damage Control II
Power Diagnostic System II

Large Shield Extender II
Large Shield Booster II
Invulnerability Field II
Invulnerability Field II

Modulated Strip Miner II, Veldspar Mining Crystal I
Modulated Strip Miner II, Veldspar Mining Crystal I
Modulated Strip Miner II, Veldspar Mining Crystal I

Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I
Medium Core Defence Field Purger I

Mining Drone II x5

still the same damn CPU+PG+CAP+CAP RECHARGE problems.

TECH II BATTLECRUISER compared to command ships !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

HAHAHAHA

To obviously trolling
Get brain to get the sense behind this fit.

LSE => from 1994 to 5439 shild == anti sozials like you need more then just a 15m T2 fit Trasher to gank (FU YOU)
LSB => normal NPC tanking

And I would fit even more EHP into the MISSING 4 slots just to make YOU use more expensive ships!

you do not get the point ... or you just want to troll ... or you do not get the point and becouse of this you trol

I think people are simply smarter than this. They do not care if their Hulk gets ganked or if CCP gives them a better tank. I, and this is just me and not everyone, do not have fun with buying a Hulk. I then post here and voice my opinion. Must players do not do this either. Does this make us automatically wrong? No.

I do not understand your second point. Ganking does not make an environment safe or very safe.

Try not to look at the numbers then.

Gotta agree with T

But you should be required to keep those biomassed gank alts for a set time imo. Yeah its a exploit to biomass them but the ccp ppl are forever saying they dont have the ppl to watch every biomass so theres a big loophole

T3, deadspace-fit PVE strategic cruisers costing 1-2 billion isk can be ganked by 1-2 hurricanes costing 10% as much.

Over-all, it's suicide ganking as a whole that's too powerful, since there's essentially zero risk of a pre-emptive strike against the offenders.

Considering that it's supposedly PVP, the risk to suiciders should come from other players, not a 20 second CONCORD timer.

Be fair. ISK prices are a balancing factor. CCP has made changes to the balance by adjusting the bill of materials as well as to the source of materials a few times. They cannot adjust the price itself. How could they?

People then fly the Hulk often because they can skill for it after the Covetor for only a little bit of extra time and because Hulkageddon does not catch all Hulks. If gankers were putting more effort into it then how do you think would this affect the numbers?

No, at the end of the day it comes down to:

"don't buff my eazy kills"

Numbers?

Take slot numbers from Command ship, remove weapons, add mining laser.
EHP, defens, aligne time stay the same.

Don't really care for the outcome of this discussion, but I'd like the see that small fleet of destroyers take down a command ship before concord arrives, as this is the point someone is making. 2/3 Destroyers taking down a 300mil ship in less time than concord needs to arrive.

I agree with BCs, whatever tier, ganking. There's "some" investment there. But destroyers? That's peanuts.


And please don't tell me that a "small" fleet is 12 dessies


On the other side, no one is making anyone fly a hulk. You know it's expensive, some of you actually know it sucks as it doesn't deliver even a near advantage to the cost scalling.... so, fly a covetor! :| If I was mining in highsec, I'd fly a covetor! When I was in wspace, I flew covetors and it worked great! :)

The whole discussion is rather pointless as I doubt CCP will buff the hulk.

So you are saying it is fair because a miner who doesn't have combat skills gets kill rights? I'm sure they are going to warp right to their hanger, grab their pvp ship that can not only find said pilot after a few gate jumps. And of course proceed to chase them into their possible null sec home or 1v1 with their superior combat skills?

No one is going to sit around to "possibly" get ganked by the person they just ganked. And further more, even if they did... They most likely have better skills and a ship to fight them. Not to mention could just as easily play station games until the other player gets bored, dies, or their right to kill them ends.

The current system is flawed. So I guess CCP needs to either pod gankers with concord. Or try to keep hulk ganking from being an eve online past time. The fact that it is a seasonal practice alone makes you realize how borked it is.

Dude, I can't mine at all (except Arbitrator with T1 mining drones). With none of my chars.

I'm just not such an ******* to not see the fail in balance and I don't try to defend this fail like you.

Do I want to PvP? Sure, I do it every day!
Do I need such an eazy target for my e-peen? No!
Does it mean I just star "fair fights"? For sure not *g*. Enter the space of my ally and you are dead. Doesn't matter if you fly a shuttle or multi billion mothership.

BUT as I like EVE I know this game can just survive when all professions are balanced. Not just the one I prefare.
Without miners (and highsec miners too) I can't buy ships or equip as I have sero interest in mining+production.

With the lose of drone regions I allready know the price will rise like crazy.
If Hulkgeddon starts and the ore from all this highsec miners is missing too I allready know T1 stuff will become crazy expensive.

And don't let's forget: 90% of all AFK highsec miners are ALTS FROM 00/low guys!!

We allready prove decent buffer tank fit is imposible.

And it is allready mentioned, that scanner is useless in high as you can't allways jump out as soon as some neutral enter the system.

And we allready prove, that a decent gank can kill ANY Hulk equal of fitting in less then 10 seconds (Hulk alligne time 17.4 seconds!!!!!!!).

So who do you try to impress with your lies?

ROFL

Exhumers should be redesigned, more slots, power grid same line with tier 3 battleships. They should be able to fit 100 000 EHP tank.

Claims do not make facts. try again fish

Why?

Keep talking fish

And in that time we've seen:

Tech 3 battlecruisers
T3 battlecruisers
Destroyer buff
Blaster/railgun buff

So when do Hulks get some love to counter this?

Not all mining ships can mine 3000m3/min. Only two can where one of them costs 300m ISKs. It is not ridiculously powerful for mining.

And it is followed closely by the pod.

But seriously, we are not talking about buffs here. We are talking about the reasons for why it needs ships to be as weak as they are while EVE is a PvP game. Who likes to flying a mining ship? I know I do not. You can talk about how the game needs to be, but one needs to be fair and talk about it. No one cares for people who just say that it has to be like this without having a good reason for it. For example, rookies should start in weak ships, because they need to learn a lot about EVE and its players, its organizations and how to fit in. You cannot give them a strong ship at start or else you have them rampaging all over the place. So if you can then give reasons why miners need to be the designated victims in EVE.

I think we have many victims every day for plenty of reasons and I see no demand to create a ship class only to have some more. I see the weak tanks of the mining ships as a design flaw in the concept of EVE as being a PvP game. It does not need ships for victims.

It still remains a fact. In a fleet the Hulk cannot fullfil it's intended use, as it is required to tank for survivabilty.

Name any other ship that gimps it's role withing a fleet, by tanking to the max for survivabilty. The fact that the ganker has first dibs on engagement, already puts the hulk at a disadvatage.

And please. Do not use the "Combat" arguement. All ships are in a combat zone. The tank on all ships should reflect this. As standard. Also you can argue All combat ships have a minimum of 2 defensive mechanisms some 3. The hulk, has the lowest of these mechanisms.

Now I am not saying the Hulk needs a buff. But it is not in a good place. It is only popular because there is not a choice of top end mining ships. Most miners fly a Hulk. How does it compare with all 4 T3 BC's or standard BC's added together. Also Mining probably has the largest amount of people doing it, for iskie making.

The cost of the Hulk does affect the ganking amount. there is no denying that. But it should not ever reflect it's performance. The value of a product is what people are prepared to pay for it. nothing more.

As in all cases solo play should require you to find a happy medium, between role and survivabilty. The Hulk does this exceptionally well. I cannot argue with that. Unfortunately buffing the Hulk for fleet play, will give solo play a buff it does not need. Added to this. Most miners will use any buff to tank, to increase yield.

All in all it is the mentality of most miners that need to change. Play as the situation dictates.


o7

So you fly a gimped megathron in a fleet?

Please read the post again